better shoot out their eyes with rubber bullets, that will teach them to break curfew
yes it absolutely fucking would have. he did the opposite and things have remained stunningly peaceful for how the police are treating people. if they would have actually made an effort to to calm things down this would already be over.
i think that kind of undermines the spirit of the protest itself, no? this is a deep systemic problem that cannot be solved with nice words or firing a few bad eggs. its a serious and complicated issue. so i would feel pretty bad if it could be solved with just "an effort to calm things down". lots of times for good reason people arent satisfied with just a few crumbs.
human lives are more valuable than property
and this is about protecting the rights of human lives
so no, it's not. if that is the only possible way to make change than that is what has to happen.
like in MN they trashed a fucking target and a starbucks and conservatives had a melt down, but black people being murdered left right and centre doesn't make them bat an eye. it's disgusting as far as I'm concerned.
insom you're roughly equivalent to the cops who shoot protesters with rubber bullets
You think violence is justified by your moral position
They think violence is justified by their moral position
You each have some mythology (eg. ACAB or "protesters are all violent looters and anarchists") which allows you to justify bad behavior
if enough people got satisfied things would slow down over time, more and more people would go home, and by now it would be over. it wouldn't need to be everybody being appeased all at once, just enough of them to create a snowball effect until the protests ended.
instead the exact opposite happened. and still in certain cities things are calming down. trump literally took centre stage just to shit on these brave people risking their health, saftey, and lives (and risking catching a fucking disease) and calls them "scum"
the difference is I'm advocating for self defence in response to fascist oppression
No, you're reframing violence as self defense and reframing your opponents as fascists
thats exactly it tho. the conservative meltdown is the precise tactic that we should play around.
trashing stores doesnt help black people. it hurts the cause by giving the opposition leverage. it hurts everyone around except for trump, so i argue it should be unambiguously condemned.
and don't you dare say "oh but then you can just do the violence against anyone" like no. fucking no. that is not what is happening, and that is not what I would advocate for.
most of these people are far more kind, empathetic, and intelligent than the police they are protesting against.
(claim based on hot air)
like i would advise any protestor not to trash anything at the very least because its bad politics. its also bad politics to indicate you are in any way supporting trashing things. so theres nothing lost to completely disassociate from the violence.
what's the alternative? just keep letting black people get murdered for no reason forever? just keep letting American police brutalize people with impunity forever? no knock warrants and shoot people and dart off? kill people begging in hallways by asking them to crawl towards you under threat of death and then blasting them when they fuck up forever?
are you suggesting nothing needs to change?
violence is already happening, and the protesters are not the ones who started it.
body cams. no more qualified immunity. re-allocation of funds. mandatory social workers for mental health related visits.
but "rioters looters and thugs" is totally not hot air right?
that entire fucking DHS video which I forced myself to watch was hot air.
where's the video of them trying to burn down the federal building? where is it?
seems like the type of thing he shouldn't be omitting
why are we supposed to take his word for it when literally thousands of people are saying that never happened
why is "doxxing" suddenly a good enough reason for officers to not display name tags?
why does he omit the fact that it's only the officers who commit brutal, evil, sadistic acts being doxxed, and it's a direct response to the fact they're almost never punished by the department or the state
looting is wrong because its politically suboptimal. any looter who does it should stop because they are helping trump argue against the BLM movement.
indicating support for looting is wrong because its politically suboptimal. anyone who indicates support for looting should stop because they are opening up an avenue of attack that lets people shift the focus away from the BLM movement.
its the same regarding the doxxing stuff: even if you personally hold such moral positions, its not very good to literally advocate for mob justice because it opens yourself up to attack. just focus on the accountability lines imo. you shouldnt indicate support for crimes. also personally i do not support crimes.
No it's wrong because it's violent
well, thats just like, your opinion, man. we must find common ground!
suppose that looting did help black people. then maaaybe you could argue that the reduction of violence against black people socially justifies the violence against shop owners. and then maybe the government can send the shop owners some money to compensate and everyone can be happy.
but it doesnt help black people so its just senseless violence.
no, trump is reframing protesters as rioters, looters, and thugs, and then telling his police to push and push and push them until they eventually turn into that, because people will naturally fight back when they are pushed too far.
how exactly would you describe the Lafayette square church photo op incident? because the people sure didn't look like rioters looters or thugs to me.
spray painting "ACAB" everywhere and pulling down some statues, and maybe smashing up a starbucks or two isn't a fucking riot.
real riots kill hundreds of people.
this is what a real riot looks like
and even though I don't support the horrific shit that happened here, it sounds like Uighurs have always had a pretty raw deal, and they finally got pushed past their breaking point when two men were falsely accused of rape and beaten to death and the legal system did nothing to stop it. it's really not that dissimilar. China let things get out of hand and since then they've been ethnically cleansing these people from their country.
now they get thrown into cages and forced to eat pork, to speak chinese, and then put into labour camps and when they die their organs are harvested. do you know what gave them the justification to do all this? A FUCKING RIOT
Fascists WANT their enemies to riot, that's why Trump has been spewing that word since Floyd died