fuck the police general

[_jdance]

does anyone here have any bumper stickers on their car?

[big_ass]

Editorial: Anti-Semitism and Black Lives Matter - Jewish Journal

[electrowizard]

@big_ass

productive progressive change within the system

Give an example. I already showed how the system gutted what the nonviolent Civil Rights movement worked towards.

@big_ass

they want the only solution to be burning the system down.

When the system is fundamentally broken and can't be reformed, this is the only solution. You still have not presented a single reason why it isn't, nor have you responded to the citations and arguments as to why it is.

@big_ass

There isn't even really a coherent and unified vision of what happens after you burn the system down.

There is no unified vision, but there are many coherent visions. The issue is that no visions can be evaluated or become reality until the system they are meant to replace is torn apart.

@big_ass

They just want to be violently opposed to things in general

No, we realize that violence is necessary to avoid the trap of reformism, which I've cited shitloads of SCOTUS cases showing that reformism doesn't work. It's also necessary to give legitimacy to non-violent movements, an argument you've never responded to.

@big_ass

resist positive changes/positive people

Which ones?

[hbotz]

so ewiz is a violent martyr who commits crimes so nonviolent protestors look legitimate by comparison??

i mean maybe i can respect that. then go ahead and get arrested and put on FBI watchlists i guess.

note: i do not support committing crimes, please do not commit crimes.

[_jdance]

every once in a while this stream comes in at 1080p for 5 seconds and the sound clears such that it sounds like my ear unclogging of water

[big_ass]

Have you ever heard of a pogrom?

If so, you probably picture a band of 18th-century Cossacks riding through the Polish countryside on horses to loot and burn Jewish villages, or shtetls, killing women, children and anything else that moves.

Replace the 18th-century Cossacks with young 21st-century Americans, the horses with cars and the Jewish shtetls with the Fairfax neighborhood of Los Angeles on the night of May 30, 2020.

The locals are calling it the “Shavuos Pogrom.”

In what is a widely underreported event, protesters from the Black Lives Matter group of Los Angeles purposely met in the oldest Jewish neighborhood in the region to destroy Jewish businesses, schools and synagogues. In all, they managed to loot a large number of stores, three Jewish schools and five synagogues. The next day, locals woke up to scrawled graffitied images reading an obscene message attacking Jews, “Free Palestine,” and, perhaps scariest of all, “Kill the Jews!”

On the night of May 30, while the rioters looted and burned without the intervention of the local police, they chanted an obscene message attacking the police and saying “kill the Jews.”

It’s not a far cry from 18th-century Poland, is it?

And lest you think that this was perhaps a small group of people who took advantage of the BLM protests to steal valuables and really had nothing to do with them, let me show you how that is not the case.

The “protest” was organized by BLM-L.A.’s leader, Melina Abdullah, who has on numerous occasions said incredibly anti-Semitic things, as well as endorsing and defending multiple outspoken anti-Semites like Louis Farrakhan.

It was clear why she decided to hold the looting in L.A.’s oldest Jewish neighborhood, rather than anywhere else in the vast city, when she made claims to the area’s “white affluence”: “We’ve been very deliberate in saying that the violence and pain and hurt that’s experienced on a daily basis by black folks at the hands of a repressive system should also be visited upon, to a degree, to those who think that they can just retreat to white affluence.” Never mind the fact that the majority of people affected were small, non-white business owners, most of whom sold non-resellable goods like bread, food, clothing, or medicine.

But Ms. Abdullah’s deliberate anti-Semitism doesn’t end there. She has often been seen speaking at Nation of Islam and Louis Farrakhan events, prasing him and others. Mr. Farrakhan has repeatedly said that, “Those who call themselves ‘Jews,’ who are not really Jews, but are in fact Satan,” praised Hitler by claiming, “Hitler was trying to destroy the international bankers controlling Europe” and often simply refers to Jews as “termites.”

This sort of language hasn’t stopped Ms. Abdullah from praising and even defending Mr. Farrakhan. Ms. Abdullah’s daughter, Thandiwe, has also hopped onto the hate train, claiming that the Jews have committed “genocide” against Palestinians in the Middle East.

Again, Melina Abdullah and her ilk are not isolated actors choosing to be racist in isolation. Melina is the official head of BLM Los Angeles and a professor of pan-African studies at CalState.

She has officially cemented the relationship between BLM and the Nation of Islam, saying, “Minister Farrakhan was calling on folks not to spend their dollars with the white corporations that keep us oppressed, and so we partnered with the Nation and helped to amplify that call.”

What does all of this add up to?

Well, very little, in the eyes of the national media. In a Front Page Magazine article, author ■■■■■■ Greenfield wrote that, “The media repeatedly described Abdullah as an activist against police violence while ignoring her affinity for a racist black supremacist hate group whose leader has described Jews as satanic and subhuman.”

He goes on to say that it is scary how underreported the events that took place on the night of May 30 are. That is why I am writing this article for my local community here in Santa Barbara. I want the people here to know that Black Lives Matter, the organization, is far from perfect and should be scrutinized more harshly for harboring such anti-Semitic characters as Mellina Abdullah.

Please join me as I write future letters to explore the BLM charter and what it actually stands for, my clashes with BLM protesters in the Santa Barbara City Council, how BLM can adversely affect this community, and, finally, what you can do about it.

https://newspress.com/blm-l-a-leader-and-anti-semitism/

[hbotz]

is "free palestine" and "f-- isreal" antisemitic?

[electrowizard]

@hbotz

yes. similarly, you are strawmanning capitalism.

It's not a strawman. Capitalism as defined and analyzed by everyone including its proponents is premised upon accumulation of surplus value. This logically and necessarily implies that there will be some that accumulate surplus value and some that have their value stolen. This is recognized by even proponents of capitalism: they just argue it's not that bad.

@hbotz

what if the underclass is robots? the real reason capitalism might collapse is that workers are going obselete, not that they are being exploited.

The replacement of workers with robots, dooming them to a life of poverty is exploitation. It forces them to take jobs that pay far less and lessens their already miniscule powers in the employee/employer relationship.

[hbotz]

though, i suppose the motivations of the people yelling those things is almost certainly anti-semitic. does anybody actually care about palestinians? so i guess its unimportant.

[big_ass]

I care about Palestinians.

[Nyte]

If my house that I don’t own (but all my stuff) burned down I would be affected for sure but I wouldn’t hate any protesters and I wouldn’t think it was a meaningless loss. Resources are necessary but I also believe that morality is necessary. Morals can be seen as a different kind of resource.

[hbotz]

then similarly i declare that my characterization of communism is not a strawman. we arent going anywhere.

i advocate for ideal capitalism where people make gains from trade and you advocate for ideal communism where ideal decisions are made by collections of unions.

[electrowizard]

@big_ass

Replace the 18th-century Cossacks with young 21st-century Americans, the horses with cars and the Jewish shtetls with the Fairfax neighborhood of Los Angeles on the night of May 30, 2020.

Disingenuous: this happened across all of Beverly Hills, of which Fairfax is a district. There was no singling out of Jewish businesses or targeting: there was the destruction of the property of the wealthy across all of Beverly Hills.

The Anti-Defamation League invested all of this. It's a lie:

https://la.adl.org/news/fake-news-and-social-media-exaggerate-l-a-protest-anti-semitism-say-local-leaders/

[hbotz]

okay. this is fair.

i wouldnt hate any individual protestors in particular either if that happened to me since mobs are not people. but i expect i would be pretty convinced that "all this has gone too far", which is what the conservatives want you to think by cherrypicking examples of violent protest.

i dont think BLM is burning down an appreciable number of houses. i guess i am saying that i dont personally think increasing the house-burning rate is worth it. but i guess you can disagree with that.

[big_ass]

Imagine framing your own house being burned down in the fight against white supremacy as a moral and necessary action

Imagine being hbotz and responding to that with "ok this is fair."

[electrowizard]

@hbotz

maybe we can blanket ban media personalization. everyone sees the same search results. no directed advertising. feeds are randomly selected among people you follow (this may not actually be good enough)

Guess what: the American courts decided this was illegal. Another example of the failures of reformism

[hbotz]

i mean, at least some people who hate rich people hate jews, because jews are stereotypically rich. its not like you can blanket deny anti-semitism.

i also want to know about the relative discrimination against blacks after controlling for poverty. i presume it still exists. of course it is unjust that blacks are disproportionately poor. it is also a true statement that jews are disproportionately wealthy.

[electrowizard]

@big_ass

Real white privilege is speculating on the internet about abolishing the police, burning down local businesses and federal courthouses, but not living in those communities that are being looted, rioted, burned down and never having to feel any of the effects of these changes

Lmao all the looting and rioting you cited in LA was in fucking Beverly Hills. All the looting in DC (only happened one night) was in fucking Georgetown. These are the neighborhoods of the rich, not the poor people.

[_jdance]

[_jdance]